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 recup or life?

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Sant

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PostSubject: recup or life?   Sun Nov 14, 2010 6:49 am

I prefer life becuz when the spirit goes down it still does stuff. Plus less energy. Plus if u do the math, it heals for a TAD bit more.
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Kay vs Forum
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Sun Nov 14, 2010 1:00 pm

Sant wrote:
I prefer life becuz when the spirit goes down it still does stuff. Plus less energy. Plus if u do the math, it heals for a TAD bit more.

If recup goes down, you dropped it in a bad spot. If you run out of energy because of recup every {long ass recharge}, you're doing something wrong. Your math is based on the idea that every life heal will pop at a time when no-one is at max. Recup heals whoever needs it, when they need it. Also, it's a continuous effect that makes it easier for the monks to work around, as it's not a one-shot-heal that might be great or terrible depending on, pretty much, random chance.

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Sant

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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Sun Nov 14, 2010 7:06 pm

Life popping when noone needs it is a bit like recup being around someone with full health. I call when life is gonna pop and if its heavy pressure I call when its almost gonna pop. Like if its hakfway. Its up to the healer to choose how to use the heals after that. Not that recup is for stupid ppl but talking fixes the issue with it. It rly is just a matter of preference to me
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:51 pm

Recup is better.
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:13 pm

Con wrote:
Recup is better.

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Sant

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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:03 pm

Why? I need reasons.
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Kay vs Forum
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Tue Nov 16, 2010 12:51 pm

Already listed them, but I will again in more detail.

Lets start with the sheer healing math:

Life, at 14 resto, heals for 140 every 20 seconds, assuming full duration and recast on recharge. Over a recup lifespan (43 seconds) this would be 280 hp (2 pops)

Recuperation, at 14 resto, heals for 6 health every second, assuming full duration and recast on recharge, which equivolates to 120 health over a Life(PvP) lifespan (20 seconds), 258 health over it's own lifespan (43 seconds).

So yes, you're right, numbers-wise Life pumps more hp.

Next up, lets look at efficacy of that potential healing, divided into two points.

1. Rt stand time.
2. Wasted healing.

Stand time

Relatively minor compared to the second point, but still important. Considering the fact that you're a flagger, you wont be spending all your time at the stand. Even more importantly, the window for party heals is relatively slim, considering that you need to shuttle/push flags, defend base against splits, support offensive splits, etc etc. So when we look at "stand time", Recuperation is the obvious winner. You can drop a life in the brief window you're within spirit range of your team, and it will pump 140 health after 20 seconds. If you drop a recup, it will pump 258 hp over 43 seconds.

Now looking at flag pushing affecting recasts, going by Trini's very handy flagging time post, average time from spawn to stand and back on any map, is roughly 45 seconds. (25 seconds to get there with flag, 20 seconds to get back without flag.) This means you only need to drop recup once, every "to stand and back" trip. Whereas you would have to drop life twice to get the same returns, and thats assuming you drop it in the right spot, and perfect conditions. One would be inclined to say recup is, again, the most efficient.

Wasted healing

Life

Probably the most important point. lets go back to the math for a moment. Disregarding NPCs for the sake of simplicity, a perfect life-drop will provide your party with 140*8=1120 Hp every 20 seconds. Roughly the same amount of redbar as casting word on recharge for 20 seconds. Seems awesome, right? Now for the downside: It's highly conditional. If your entire party, including yourself, is not below 80% health, then Life starts seeing a steep decline in effective healing. Say only half your party is at 80%, then the effective healing becomes only 560 hp, roughly the equivalent of 3 word casts.

Similarly, if for example one half of your party is at 30% health, and the other half at 100%, you still wont get any more out of a healing pop than that same 560 hp.

Then there's the simple fact that life only heals at it's end. If you happen to need heals during its 20 second lifespan, you're boned. If you happen to not need healing as it ends, you're boned again. Window for life to be an optimally effective heal is relatively tiny.

tl;dr: When *any* bar is over 80%, you lose potential healing and therefor efficiency. There is a maximum on the amount Life can heal (140hp). In between procs, Life does nothing.

Recup

Same as before, step back to the math. A single recup-drop, will, assuming the same perfect conditions, heal roughly 2064 hp. So the simple-situation numbers are higher than life's. Now let's look at it's downsides: If a target is at 100%, recuperation won't provide any healing unless that target is suffering from degeneration. However, that means in any situation where there is degeneration on the party, recup becomes effective even if on people that are sitting at 100% health.

tl;dr: Recuperation won't heal anyone at 100% health, although it still cancels out degeneration.


Conclusion:

Life may pump more sheer HP, math wise, assuming perfect recast, but if you look at the efficiency of that healing, A lot of it is wasted, because of:

  • Burst healing requires *everyone* to be below 80% to get optimal returns.
  • Healing stops past it's predetermined amount (140), even if potential healing is not met.
  • Life's window to be effective is tiny. It will sit there and let your party wipe if it doesnt happen to proc at the exact right time.


Recuperation, on the other hand, not only pumps more sheer healing per single recast, making it better as a fire and forget pressure mitigator while flagging, it also provides 100% of it's potential healing all of the time, unless someone is at 100% health suffering from no degeneration. In which case they would not need healing anyway.

  • Higher healing per cast.
  • Heals those who need it, when they need it, up to it's potential max, without conditionals.
  • Constant mitigation, rather than random bursts of potentially wasted redbar.
  • Even effective on allies at 100% hp, if said allies suffer from degeneration.


Clearly, with less downsides, and numerous advantages in terms of meeting potential healing max aswell as recastibility, Recuperation is the better pressure mitigator. It potentially heals for more per recast, and the condition to get that potential is considerably easier to meet. It's pretty much just better in every way.

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Last edited by Kay vs Forum on Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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Con

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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:41 pm

Sant wrote:
Why? I need reasons.

It makes your bars regen.
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:02 pm

Women lie, men lie, numbers don't lie. I have been swayed.
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:42 am

LoD HP monk!
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Kay vs Forum
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:38 am

Stupid idea.

LoD necro on the other hand.

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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:02 pm

nigga got raped by a big ass post just like pamz got raped by a big _ _ _ _! Woo go sensory
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:33 pm

saw a team use LoD Necro, except they also used AoF so conditions built up and they died.
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PostSubject: Re: recup or life?   Thu Nov 18, 2010 11:21 am

We've played with an LoD necro a couple of games. works pretty well.

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